Post game.... Nice road win for GB. Full wrap up in the AM
Post Game: Packers Defeat Redskins 21-17
- Thread starter Mark87
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That was god awful. I'm not sure this team even sniffs the playoffs this year.. OL looks to be mediocre again, DEF has no fire, and offense isn't as good as advertised, they can't buy an RB to save their lives, and our TE are still non existent. Crappy playcalling from MM, and this season looks to be another one in which they waste Arods golden years...
Just kidding. I didn't watch... my son and I were watching cartoons...
Just kidding. I didn't watch... my son and I were watching cartoons...
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Didn't get to see much of the game, but I caught Rodger's TD to Bennett and...I think it was Jones' TD from Hundley.
I saw a couple of plays with Spriggs in there and he really looked bad. Callahan didn't have a chance. I don't know if Spriggs played with Hundley or not but his missed protections when he was playing were terrible. I couldn't tell if he was over-matched or if it was his footwork or what. But we were to pick an 'Ugly' Spriggs would be it.
Janis showed up again with the pass he caught from Hundley and made a nice block on that play...I think it was to Allison to help him get some great yardage.
Williams didn't look too good from what I saw and some of Vogel's punts didn't have much hang time. But A. Jones had a couple of nice runs. Speaking of Jones, did J. Jones play? I never saw him out there.
I'm looking forward to watching the replay to see what I missed.
I'd be interested in your comments.
I saw a couple of plays with Spriggs in there and he really looked bad. Callahan didn't have a chance. I don't know if Spriggs played with Hundley or not but his missed protections when he was playing were terrible. I couldn't tell if he was over-matched or if it was his footwork or what. But we were to pick an 'Ugly' Spriggs would be it.
Janis showed up again with the pass he caught from Hundley and made a nice block on that play...I think it was to Allison to help him get some great yardage.
Williams didn't look too good from what I saw and some of Vogel's punts didn't have much hang time. But A. Jones had a couple of nice runs. Speaking of Jones, did J. Jones play? I never saw him out there.
I'm looking forward to watching the replay to see what I missed.
I'd be interested in your comments.
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We don't have a pass defense. We don't have a running game. They can't block on run plays, just passing.
Goode is handling FG & EP snaps? The new guy is handling punt snaps? Are you serious? Are they still trying to tell Goode he should be gone? Give him the punt snaps too. The guy needs to be in tune with Goode on each snap. Sometimes I think the Packers coaching staff is totally oblivious to reality.
I nearly cried watching Spriggs play left tackle. Seriously. His footwork was bad. His body positioning was horrible. Even his hands weren't being used effectively. The best play he had was when he grabbed the guy going outside, and was called for it. I've seen guys who've never played the position, and were given 5 minute crash courses on playing there, perform better. I'm not impressed by their run blocking, as a team. They stink! They did not open one hole the entire game. Once again, our QBs were our running game.
Tayson Hill has some quicks. Hundley looked pretty good. Callahan had a game to forget. Another one like that and he's gone when cut downs come. Hill will obviously beat him out if it doesn't change. I think Hill might end up being a decent NFL QB.
The biggest disappointment, to this point, is the pass defense. All the talk of improvement was merely talk.
We don't have any real running backs.
Goode is handling FG & EP snaps? The new guy is handling punt snaps? Are you serious? Are they still trying to tell Goode he should be gone? Give him the punt snaps too. The guy needs to be in tune with Goode on each snap. Sometimes I think the Packers coaching staff is totally oblivious to reality.
I nearly cried watching Spriggs play left tackle. Seriously. His footwork was bad. His body positioning was horrible. Even his hands weren't being used effectively. The best play he had was when he grabbed the guy going outside, and was called for it. I've seen guys who've never played the position, and were given 5 minute crash courses on playing there, perform better. I'm not impressed by their run blocking, as a team. They stink! They did not open one hole the entire game. Once again, our QBs were our running game.
Tayson Hill has some quicks. Hundley looked pretty good. Callahan had a game to forget. Another one like that and he's gone when cut downs come. Hill will obviously beat him out if it doesn't change. I think Hill might end up being a decent NFL QB.
The biggest disappointment, to this point, is the pass defense. All the talk of improvement was merely talk.
We don't have any real running backs.
I will disagree with a couple of things people have said.
I think Williams actually looked okay at RB last night. He was decisive and ran with power, often moving the pile, on that initial drive. He's not an explosive outside the tackles type who is going to get far more yards than what is blocked but he can be a solid back. After the starting OL left the game, it got ugly in a hurry. I think that's a huge part of why the backs looked so bad the rest of the game.
I thought the pass defense was also OK early but with the injuries we were playing pretty far down the depth chart earlier than normal and it showed. Again, with the starters playing on both sides, I thought the defense held up well. We'll see how that translates to the regular season.
Then there is the back-up OL - ugh. I defended Spriggs on a couple of plays, but he had a bad night. To early to say he's a bust, but man he better shore things up. That was a miserable performance. Not that the rest of the back-up OL held up much better. Letting Lang and Tretter go really hurt the depth. Evans has been fine replacing Lang, but Tretter is missed. They need to continue to draft OL harder than they have been.
Agree that Hill is starting to move ahead of Callahan. He's bigger, faster and has a better arm. I think they will try to stash Hill on the PS and let Callahan go unless the next couple of pre-season games play out differently than the last two.
I think Williams actually looked okay at RB last night. He was decisive and ran with power, often moving the pile, on that initial drive. He's not an explosive outside the tackles type who is going to get far more yards than what is blocked but he can be a solid back. After the starting OL left the game, it got ugly in a hurry. I think that's a huge part of why the backs looked so bad the rest of the game.
I thought the pass defense was also OK early but with the injuries we were playing pretty far down the depth chart earlier than normal and it showed. Again, with the starters playing on both sides, I thought the defense held up well. We'll see how that translates to the regular season.
Then there is the back-up OL - ugh. I defended Spriggs on a couple of plays, but he had a bad night. To early to say he's a bust, but man he better shore things up. That was a miserable performance. Not that the rest of the back-up OL held up much better. Letting Lang and Tretter go really hurt the depth. Evans has been fine replacing Lang, but Tretter is missed. They need to continue to draft OL harder than they have been.
Agree that Hill is starting to move ahead of Callahan. He's bigger, faster and has a better arm. I think they will try to stash Hill on the PS and let Callahan go unless the next couple of pre-season games play out differently than the last two.
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Unless Callahan has a huge week 4 game and Hill craps the bed I have no idea how you can't keep Hill as a 3rd QB though will likely be on the PS.
Vogel had a good night 7 punts 47 yard average.
The run game did not look great but then again it seemed the same MM game plan pass heavy run lite. Also I don't think this OL is going to be very good at opening holes up for the RB's anyways.
Trevor Davis is like a yo-yo. Great week last week with the TD but then this week fumbles. If he is going to be inconsistant I don't know if he can make the team.
McCaffery is a interesting guy that might make the team if they cut Davis.
Aaron Jones looks like the perfect 3rd down scat back that I thought he could be when the team drafted him.
Backup OL is a mess if any of the top 5 go down with injury this team is in trouble.
Also backup DB and LB seem to be nothing special and if we have injuries like normal this defense is going to be toasted playing these guys
The starters look to be solid but TT seems to have dropped the ball on improving the back end of the roster and with injuries pretty much guaranteed to happen every year this will be very worrisem
Vogel had a good night 7 punts 47 yard average.
The run game did not look great but then again it seemed the same MM game plan pass heavy run lite. Also I don't think this OL is going to be very good at opening holes up for the RB's anyways.
Trevor Davis is like a yo-yo. Great week last week with the TD but then this week fumbles. If he is going to be inconsistant I don't know if he can make the team.
McCaffery is a interesting guy that might make the team if they cut Davis.
Aaron Jones looks like the perfect 3rd down scat back that I thought he could be when the team drafted him.
Backup OL is a mess if any of the top 5 go down with injury this team is in trouble.
Also backup DB and LB seem to be nothing special and if we have injuries like normal this defense is going to be toasted playing these guys
The starters look to be solid but TT seems to have dropped the ball on improving the back end of the roster and with injuries pretty much guaranteed to happen every year this will be very worrisem
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here is every one of his runs from that initial drive:
1-10-GB 35 (12:48) J.Williams right guard to GB 37 for 2 yards (S.McGee; Z.Brown).
2-8-GB 37 (12:08) J.Williams right tackle to GB 42 for 5 yards (Z.Brown; E.Hood).
2-2-WAS 33 (9:41) J.Williams left end to WAS 30 for 3 yards (Z.Brown, B.Breeland). R4
1-10-WAS 30 (9:01) J.Williams left guard to WAS 26 for 4 yards (M.Ioannidis).
1-4-WAS 4 (6:19) (Shotgun) J.Williams left tackle to WAS 3 for 1 yard (M.Foster, P.Smith).
17 yards / 5 carries = 3.4 yards per carry. not impressed.
No one blocked.... The OG are crap right this minute, 4 of the 5 run were between OG/OC. Can't gain yards when the hole is closed
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I agree to an extent, RB but there were no holes for him to run through. Also, I think he drove with his legs and produced extra yards that were not there. So his yard average would have been even lower without that.Remember, it is the 2nd preseason game and we have a young RB group. There will be growing pains.
4ever, you are correct on depth but does TT ever have great depth? IMO, TT is one of the worst GM's at getting depth on his football teams. He also does not bring in FA's consistently enough to fill holes. You could say it's MM and the coaches who are not developing these draft picks the 2nd and 3rd years. But we have been talking about that for years already.
My concern with Hill is he is a running QB. Can he really develop into a decent and accurate passer? We are talking about him playing ok against 3rd stringers here. Callahan is not much better. At this point, I think we keep one on the practice squad because we have no better options. That also takes Hundley off the table for a trade because we have no good back-ups besides Hundley.
4ever, you are correct on depth but does TT ever have great depth? IMO, TT is one of the worst GM's at getting depth on his football teams. He also does not bring in FA's consistently enough to fill holes. You could say it's MM and the coaches who are not developing these draft picks the 2nd and 3rd years. But we have been talking about that for years already.
My concern with Hill is he is a running QB. Can he really develop into a decent and accurate passer? We are talking about him playing ok against 3rd stringers here. Callahan is not much better. At this point, I think we keep one on the practice squad because we have no better options. That also takes Hundley off the table for a trade because we have no good back-ups besides Hundley.
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On the OL vs RBs issue. There were no holes opened by the line. There was nobody on the field at RB who could create one. It was nearly as painful as watching the Packers of the 80s, when we saw Harlan Huckleby run up to the line, and turn around, then push with his back, to try to get any yardage. It was nauseating. It was both Harlan and the line. They both sucked! Sorry!
Our problem is that our OL has been designed to pass protect, and they haven't advanced their skills enough to open holes for the running game. That's probably why the Packers didn't bother to do too much, in getting solid RBs in house. Why bother? Ain't going to gain real estate anyway, unless they're in a total prevent defense.
I'm not going to blame the DL or the ILBs for the breakdown in passing between the hash marks. I mentioned in another thread a week ago, that we may have gone to the "nitro" defense, but at this point, it's nothing more than a lady finger as far as explosiveness. Watching ILBs not having a chance to make plays gets old. Even the announcers "kinda" mentioned it last night. They felt empathy for the slower LBs against speed backs coming out of the backfield.
Watching our ILBs playing 10 yards off the ball, then trying to dive down into short pass coverage is unreal. They can't stay with a guy already, why in hell would you allow them to get off the line of scrimmage at a dead run, and make a move on you, while you're trying to adjust your angle to cover them. You're beat, and it isn't your fault. It's the scheme. These RBs, and WRs know they have the latitude to turn their route in, out, and at various angles, just to get clear of your coverage, and they'll do it every time. The only question is whether or not our D-line can make a play before the guy gets clearance on the LB. It don't happen often enough to stop that pass from being a completion. It takes less time to run this type of play than any other passing play in their repetoire.
Ask yourself this question. Why do opponents make so many crossing route completions in open field, where the Packers rarely get one that's not challenged, and stopped immediately in most cases? The answer is not who is playing ILB, it's how they're having them play the position.
Right now, I don't see the Packers anywhere near being able to judge players, let alone start the season. Why do we almost always start off rougher than most other teams? Amazing!
Our problem is that our OL has been designed to pass protect, and they haven't advanced their skills enough to open holes for the running game. That's probably why the Packers didn't bother to do too much, in getting solid RBs in house. Why bother? Ain't going to gain real estate anyway, unless they're in a total prevent defense.
I'm not going to blame the DL or the ILBs for the breakdown in passing between the hash marks. I mentioned in another thread a week ago, that we may have gone to the "nitro" defense, but at this point, it's nothing more than a lady finger as far as explosiveness. Watching ILBs not having a chance to make plays gets old. Even the announcers "kinda" mentioned it last night. They felt empathy for the slower LBs against speed backs coming out of the backfield.
Watching our ILBs playing 10 yards off the ball, then trying to dive down into short pass coverage is unreal. They can't stay with a guy already, why in hell would you allow them to get off the line of scrimmage at a dead run, and make a move on you, while you're trying to adjust your angle to cover them. You're beat, and it isn't your fault. It's the scheme. These RBs, and WRs know they have the latitude to turn their route in, out, and at various angles, just to get clear of your coverage, and they'll do it every time. The only question is whether or not our D-line can make a play before the guy gets clearance on the LB. It don't happen often enough to stop that pass from being a completion. It takes less time to run this type of play than any other passing play in their repetoire.
Ask yourself this question. Why do opponents make so many crossing route completions in open field, where the Packers rarely get one that's not challenged, and stopped immediately in most cases? The answer is not who is playing ILB, it's how they're having them play the position.
Right now, I don't see the Packers anywhere near being able to judge players, let alone start the season. Why do we almost always start off rougher than most other teams? Amazing!
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