The it was "skewed" crap is sour grapes.....Aaron is gone you can cease and desist with the #12 worship and I will add AR didn't play OL/DL /DB / WR/ TE/K etc.....it takes 22 plus in FB to win.
Packers 2023-24 Season Thread
- Thread starter Mark87
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Mark,The it was "skewed" crap is sour grapes.....Aaron is gone you can cease and desist with the #12 worship and I will add AR didn't play OL/DL /DB / WR/ TE/K etc.....it takes 22 plus in FB to win.
I am just pointing out that we have no idea how good ML is as a coach. He may have changed the culture which is great but he has made some bad decisions in the playoffs and in game management. He also brough back a D-Coordinator back that no one thought should be back. Due to those reasons, I am not going to annoint him because he has a great record over 4 years. He has a lot of things to prove this year and I hope he does but if he doesn't, I won't be surprised either.
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And you conveniently leave out the horrendous QB play in a lot of those games by #12...and the crap defense. How many times did #12 check out of what ML called at the line? I don't know but neither do you. You can't put it all on the HC as we hear more and more of this CRAP coming out.
So saying that ML is is an iffy coach is rather caviler of you and it looks biased as heck.
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I don't think it's fair to say ML was ONLY a successful coach do to Rodgers, you don't get a .712 win percentage that way. I do think one of my key areas to watch is how he adjusts the offense and team without him.
The Niner's proved without a shadow of a doubt this scheme works and works well with a relatively raw QB plugged in so like others it's really the defense and intangibles that will make or break us this year.
ML can finally shape the team his way now, I don't expect a SB this season and if they make the playoffs I would be tickled pink but honestly if it goes the other way I personally wouldn't hang ML out year 1 post Rodgers and the gang for it if it happens.
We should all just enjoy the ride.
The Niner's proved without a shadow of a doubt this scheme works and works well with a relatively raw QB plugged in so like others it's really the defense and intangibles that will make or break us this year.
ML can finally shape the team his way now, I don't expect a SB this season and if they make the playoffs I would be tickled pink but honestly if it goes the other way I personally wouldn't hang ML out year 1 post Rodgers and the gang for it if it happens.
We should all just enjoy the ride.
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Continue this high standard of play in the playoffs.
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LeFleur is a good coach. He walked into a situation where there was a diva QB running the show, and had to live with it. The Packers won games because he saddled as much of the talent he could, with the cards that were dealt to him.
His only mistakes, and this is assuming it was his choice, was the decisions on special team specialists, and choice of defensive coordinators, and even that was somewhat restricted by talent available on the roster.
If anyone believes they're going to be able to judge him on his ability level during the 2023 season, they're sadly mistaken. He's pretty much taking the team in a new direction, with new people emerging as the leaders, and stars of the team. It's a difficult transition for even the best of coaches. How he handles it won't be determined by the wins and losses, but how he starts to fill in the gaps, and identify needs, that can be addressed in the 2024 season.
Personally, I have enough confidence in him to say he needs to be given a chance for the next two years, to create a new base of talent that forms the core of the team. He is probably the right guy for the job.
But, this is just my opinion.
His only mistakes, and this is assuming it was his choice, was the decisions on special team specialists, and choice of defensive coordinators, and even that was somewhat restricted by talent available on the roster.
If anyone believes they're going to be able to judge him on his ability level during the 2023 season, they're sadly mistaken. He's pretty much taking the team in a new direction, with new people emerging as the leaders, and stars of the team. It's a difficult transition for even the best of coaches. How he handles it won't be determined by the wins and losses, but how he starts to fill in the gaps, and identify needs, that can be addressed in the 2024 season.
Personally, I have enough confidence in him to say he needs to be given a chance for the next two years, to create a new base of talent that forms the core of the team. He is probably the right guy for the job.
But, this is just my opinion.
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The MLF hire genuinely saved/revived Rodgers' career and I don't know how anyone can read the evidence any other way.
Speaking of evidence, we have 4 years of Rodgers and MLF together. Let's do some comparisons.
First, we can look at the best statistical run of Rodgers' career, 2011-2014, when he won 2 MVP awards.
Then, we can look at the 4 years preceding MLF's hire to see how Rodgers was playing (and the team was winning).
Finally, we'll look at Rodgers' 4 years with MLF
Rodgers under MLF started more games, threw for more yards, won more games, took fewer sacks...
His numbers under MLF compare very nicely to his 2011-2014 stretch. But the MLF numbers BLOW AWAY the four years in between, when Rodgers had been gradually declining or stagnating.
Any argument that says "MLF's success is qualified by the fact that he had Aaron Rodgers" has to compare the MLF years to other years in Rodgers' career. The Packers had more wins in these 4 years than the other stretches, even with the losing season in 2022. Rodgers won 2 MVPs in this 4-year stretch just like he did from 2011 to 2014. And none in between.
Sure, we're all curious if he can win without Rodgers. And that will and should be taken into consideration. But it's important to note that he also won MORE with Rodgers than Rodgers was winning without him.
Again, obviously, the Super Bowl in 2010 was the topper, but unless we're arguing that McCarthy is simply a better coach than MLF because he won that Super Bowl, then it's not a trump card. Aaron Rodgers was better with MLF than he was in the years just before MLF came along, and MLF deserves that credit and respect even if he struggles without Rodgers in the coming years. The fact that his track record is littered with QBs performing at or near their best under his coaching also points to the fact that this is not a fluke of timing, but a MLF effect. Rodgers owes that latest contract he signed to MLF because without that hire, Rodgers would have been retired by now.
Speaking of evidence, we have 4 years of Rodgers and MLF together. Let's do some comparisons.
First, we can look at the best statistical run of Rodgers' career, 2011-2014, when he won 2 MVP awards.
Then, we can look at the 4 years preceding MLF's hire to see how Rodgers was playing (and the team was winning).
Finally, we'll look at Rodgers' 4 years with MLF
Rodgers under MLF started more games, threw for more yards, won more games, took fewer sacks...
His numbers under MLF compare very nicely to his 2011-2014 stretch. But the MLF numbers BLOW AWAY the four years in between, when Rodgers had been gradually declining or stagnating.
Any argument that says "MLF's success is qualified by the fact that he had Aaron Rodgers" has to compare the MLF years to other years in Rodgers' career. The Packers had more wins in these 4 years than the other stretches, even with the losing season in 2022. Rodgers won 2 MVPs in this 4-year stretch just like he did from 2011 to 2014. And none in between.
Sure, we're all curious if he can win without Rodgers. And that will and should be taken into consideration. But it's important to note that he also won MORE with Rodgers than Rodgers was winning without him.
Again, obviously, the Super Bowl in 2010 was the topper, but unless we're arguing that McCarthy is simply a better coach than MLF because he won that Super Bowl, then it's not a trump card. Aaron Rodgers was better with MLF than he was in the years just before MLF came along, and MLF deserves that credit and respect even if he struggles without Rodgers in the coming years. The fact that his track record is littered with QBs performing at or near their best under his coaching also points to the fact that this is not a fluke of timing, but a MLF effect. Rodgers owes that latest contract he signed to MLF because without that hire, Rodgers would have been retired by now.
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Excellent post. And it’s not just Rodgers, look at Aaron Jones’ and even Davante Adams’ to an extent with and without MLF. No one called Adams “Top 2 Not 2” until MLF got there. He helped bring about a culture and system that got the best players on O to thrive. Those players were all veterans. Now we get to see if he can develop young talent into high performing veterans. He might not be that kind of coach.
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What? Who the hell is this?